Middle lane drivers are the worst. Why are we such a bad nation of drivers??? The middle lane is not for lumbering along in!!

Nothing is more annoying than that and lorries overtaking lorries!! I think it’s down to years of poor testing and allowing people to drive unaccompanied on provisionals

In picture above there is absolute nothing wrong with using middle lane. The majority of Irish drivers don’t use the two second rule which makes it dangerous to merge onto motorway from slip road.Centre lane can be used if driving at speed limit.

Eire2011. So your saying 66% of those in picture are wrong. With traffic at slow pace on motorway you think everybody should use inside lane?

Especially on the M50, the amount of middle lane hoggers is ridiculous! In the M50 case, it’s nearly worse than outside lane hoggers…

The other day for example there was someone sitting doing 80 KM/H in the middle lane. There was a queue of cars on the driving/inside lane, a queue of cars behind the car at fault in the middle lane, and neither laneful of cars could get out to overtake in the overtaking/outside lane to get past as there was already a stream of cars in it!

There were people bit by bit undertaking in the leftmost/driving lane… It was just waiting for a major accident to happen! Eventuall after about 10 minutes of being stuck in that, someone blared a horn/flashed at them to move and the blockage cleared….. can’t stand idiots like that!!!! grrrr!

Not defending bad driving habits but on the roundabout issue local council have allot to answer for, I drive allot with work and I find allot of roundabouts in different towns with wrong road markings, effectively breaking the rules of the road.

Completely but there is no consistency in lane markings on roundabouts either, can be very confusing when at one roundabout straight is the accepted left lane and then the next it’s moved into the right!

Ppp
M

@ Joseph, That’s why we have road markings. The problem is that many drivers don’t even look for them, or just ignore them.
@Damien, I thought that the rules of the road state that road markings take precedence, ie. that you stay in the left lane to go straight ahead at a roundabout unless directed otherwise by road markings.

My biggest gripe with roundabouts is not the markings, but the fact that a large percentage of drivers use no indicators at all when using roundabouts. Crazy. You take your life in your hands when you use the Liffey Valley roundabout. This is not down to a lack of education on how to use a roundabout, but down to pure laziness.

@mattoid I understand that completely but most of the markings are not on the floor until you’re almost on the roundabout which doesn’t help. Also people in the right lane who edge so far forward you can’t see past them when you are taking the first exit your lane may well be free and you have to stay because they are blocking your view, is also quite intimidating when you are on a small roundabout and they do this, you wonder if they are going to jump out on top of you!

The problem is people who sit in the outside lane go the speed limit and obviously think to themselves ‘I’m going the speed limit I’m entitled to sit here’

Report then. Most are idiots that need to be fined to learn.

Worse again is some clown doing 50/60kmh in lane 1 & obstucting us (truck drivers) & we cannot overtake legally. So the next time your mirror is full of a truck bare in mind you going too slow.

All you have to do is overtake them on inside lane. Anyone who gives thumbs down for this comment should never drive.

Really? I’d say someone who advocates breaking the rules of the road should never drive

@Sean, I think that’s the most ridiculous comment in this whole thread. On the off-chance that you weren’t trolling, someone should let you know that undertaking is not only illegal, its also one of the most dangerously unpredictable manoevres you can perform – there’s a reason why its illegal!
I can understand frustration building up when you’re stuck behind a lane hogger, but undertaking is a stupid response.
So yes, I did thumb down your comment ;)

Mattoid. Page 123 on Rules of the Road “overtaking only on the right, unless traffic is moving in slow moving queues and the traffic queue on your right is travelling more slowly than you are” Wouldn’t 40 or 50 in an 80kmh be a slow moving queue?

Oh come on now you are just being obstinate for the sake of it, no its not slow moving, that caveat is designed for heavy traffic situations be it by congestion or an incident where you are crawling and often can’t change lane due to traffic volume.

Donkeys driving under the speed limit? I’m assuming that’s just a turn of phrase. I have never been behind a donkey that’s breaking the limit…… Woof

Sean mcavinue you drive in the left lane in this country so why are you saying it is ok to drive in middle lane??? That is the problem with drivers in this country. We drive in the LEFT lane. Watch the ad on the tv!!!!!

Sean mcavinue the problem is not when you are stuck in a traffic jam but you said it is ok to drive in middle lane. It’s not we drive in left lane over here. You can sit in traffic jam in any lane unless you want a 10 mile tail back!!!!

Rob … The only time it is illegal to overtake on inside lane is when driving over speed limit.

eh Sean – i’m afraid thats not true!

The only time it’s legal Sean is in very heavy traffic jams when one lane may start moving whilst another is still stationary or crawling

@ Sean Mc Avinue – You’re wrong there. According to the rules of the road, you can overtake on the left only when “Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane.”

http://www.rotr.ie/rules-for-driving/good-driving-practice/overtaking.html

Ron. If for some unknown reason car on outside lane slows down way under speed limit, does that meaner all have to slow down to that speed?

Mark. If i am driving at speed limit and traffic to my right is driving slower your saying I must slow to their speed?

Yay! Looks like Sean’s finally got it!

Yes Sean you’ve got it!! And then when it’s clear you pull out and pass them on the right!!

If car to my right is driving at 5kmh on motorway with no obstruction ahead according to all you red thumbers I have to drive at same or less. You should all give up that funny stuff!

Just when we thought you were getting it Sean… (sigh)
If there is a slow-moving idiot hogging the outside lane the only thing you can legally do is suck it up and wait for them to move, however frustrating that may be….

Mattoid. Page 45. Rules of the Road. You may overtake on the left when. “Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left- hand lane is moving more quickly than the right hand lane” As we were referring to motorways driving slowly on a 120 kmh motorway is driving faster than on a 30kmh road Ie the quays. So you try to tell me if someone driving at 60kmh on a 120 kmh motorway in overtaking lane I cannot overtaken on inside lane? Define driving “slowly” on motorway with 120 kmh limit.

Sean, please do us all a favour and follow this link to the motorway driving section of the rules of the road:
http://www.rotr.ie/rules-for-driving/motorways/on-the-motorway.html
Look for the part where it specifically mentions SLOW MOVING QUEUES of traffic as the only situation where you can legally overtake on the inside lane, ie. if there is a bumper to bumper queue of crawling traffic built up due to roadworks etc. you can pass on the inside.
If you just have an inconsiderate lanehog who is holding up a few cars in the outside lane and who happens to be driving slower than you want to its tough shit I’m afraid.

@ Sean, people are universally disagreeing with you and your interpretation of the rules of the road. See above, just about every post you have made is downvoted to hell. Are you not getting the message? Your interpretation is incorrect. I’m not being mean here but when 70-80 people tell you that you’re wrong you are most likely wrong!

Almost as bad again is when you are genuinely overtaking at 75/80mph and you get the luanatic fly up to you at approaching 100mph who then proceed to sit an inch off your rear bumper until you have cleared the slower cars and pull in, do they not get that at that speed you need reacting/stopping distance? Or are they deluded enough to think that a pile up could not possibly happen to them?

I agree what you have said but those slower drivers in the over taking lane are obstructing the flow of traffic and hence committing an offence.

Undertaking them if possible is illegal so your screwed, people caught in the over taking lane obstructing the flow of traffic should have penalty points and a fine.

They would soon enough stop doing it and also they cause road rage, which in turn potentially can cause death or serious injury.

Going to slow is as dangerous as the opposite!

It’s not an offence. On the Dual carriageway both lanes are the same. Unlike the Motorway there’s no minimum speed limit and there’s nothing to say they have to stick to the left. .

What do you mean by the use of the plural in “those slow drivers”? Do you think the car doing the tail gating is the only driver who has a right to use the overtaking lane? He’s also a slow driver, just like all of the other cars stuck behind the leading vehicle.

The car at the front is the only one choosing to drive slowly in the right hand lane, all of the others are attempting to overtake the cars in the left hand lane and can’t due to the right hand lane being blocked.

@ Jane Ward

You obviously have not read the rules of the road

Thanks for the suggestion John – you’ve hit a nerve…
Keep them coming!

Thery’re probably on an outside lane somewhere!!!!

All those people who sit there are old duffers or culchies heading to the city for the day. And they don’t read the Journal.ie. they read the Farmers Journal.

The speed limit is actually to do with the width of the lane. When the limit was 120km the lanes were wider.

Viv where did that lane width info come from?

I enquired when the upgrade was just complete as to when the limit would go back up.. Was reliably informed by Live Drive radio traffic show part of Dublin City Council.

Best analysis of the situation on the M50 to date, Patrick.

The problem is having hesitant learners on a motorway could be a recipe for disaster at those speeds. Perhaps make it compulsory to have 2 or 3 advanced or motorway lessons after you pass?

Agree 100%. To be honest it is a complete joke that you can be given a driving licence without having ever driven on a motorway. It should be a mandatory part of the exam.

Damn right, especially at pedestrian crossings in the city centre, can be like an obstacle course at times, sometimes tempted to climb over the tops of the clueless people’s cars!!

What do you mean ‘perhaps a woman’ …. It’s more than likely a woman, hands clenched at 10 and 2 and persistent stare straight ahead with the blinkers on

They don’t have a choice because of some drivers thinking its ok to do under the speed limit in the so called slow lane !!! They they come across smart arses that won’t let them back in . Most truck drivers I know only pull out if they have to and move in as soon as they can !

To be fair, I am on the road a fair bit and I am constantly seeing trucks overtaking trucks on the M1. It becomes a process which can take some 3 – 4 minutes to complete all the while holding up the show behind. Rules are rules and I am constantly seeing them broken by some drivers.

@niall mulligan…the far left lane otherwise known as the bus lane…

While I understand where you are coming from you also have to understand that trucks are limited to 90 km or there about so if they are over taking another truck they could be just a tiny bit under the limit , so for a car to be held up behind they are not doing their speed limit on the motor way !

Niamh, on a motorway? A bus lane? Any specific locations you can point out where a Motorway in Ireland has a bus lane?

Yes. The M4 has a bus lane.

That is wot the far left lane on the M50 is popularly known as….the bus lane. You hardly think I think there is a bus lane on the motorway….come on!

James, you’re thinking of the N4 which does have a bus lane. The N4 becomes the M4 after Lucan and it does not have a bus lane.

@Brian

No I’m thinking of the M4 which runs all the way to Junction 13 at Kinegad Co. Westmeath.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M4_motorway_(Ireland)

But it doesn’t have a bus lane.

There’s the dublin end of the Motorway and there’s no bus lane. I drove it on Thursday and there was no Bus Lane. You’re thinking of the N4 further up which does have a bus lane but is not a Motorway.

http://g.co/maps/dbcuw

@Brian

Ah, I see the error of my ways now ;-) I thought you were saying that the M4 started at Lucan and ran to the city centre. It actually stops at Leixlip which is about where the bus lane starts.

It’s gas and these people believe they are the “safe” drivers!! If your not confident enough to drive on the roads at busy times then simply dont!!

It’s usually old people… Just sayin

Probably the same ones who don’t bother indicating because “sure don’t I already know where I’m going?”

There is no such thing as a fast lane in this country, lane two of a motorway is not a fast lane.

We have slow lanes in this country at certain steep locations but it’s not lane one of the motorway.

Until the Garda start pulling for bad lane use on the M50 then people will keep on doing it the same way. Prob can’t fine anyone but they can delay them for 10mins while they ‘check’ the vehicle.

I’ve seen cars on Lane 1 of the motorway go faster then those in the 2nd and 3rd lanes, that is just wrong.

Unless you’re turning right, or road markings indicate otherwise, you should be in the left lane. However, on a dual carriageway it’s usually acceptable to use either, provided of course you exit the roundabout in the same lane you entered.

@Aaron You’re right of course, but very few people seem to be aware of the fact that you can’t turn right from the left lane on a round-about! It’s an unbelievable dangerous and stupid thing to do and yet extremely common to see in Ireland.

France is so road safety conscious your so right

Really road safety concious more like unconcious. You 2 should take a drive around the peripherique at rush hour one of the only roads in Europe your insurance doesnt cover you. The only crowd worse than the French are the Belgiums & the Italians.

You insurance of course covers you on the Periph’

If everybody stayed left in lane 1 and only used lane 2 when they need to overtake or lane 3 if a truck is overtaking in lane 2 then everybody else would get the hint and start using lanes the way they are meant to be used.

quote @ Barry Healy “dual carriageways are dual carriageways, there is no overtaking lane”

Wrong!

see extract below from Rules of the Road site link – http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/juntions-and-dual-carriageways.html

Dual carriageways are roads with two or more lanes of traffic travelling in each direction. The outer or right-hand lane in each direction is the lane nearest to the centre of the dual carriageway.

You must normally drive in the left-hand lane of a dual carriageway. You may use the outer lane of a two-lane or three-lane dual carriageway only:

for overtaking,
and when intending to turn right a short distance ahead.

Yes, it’s completely annoying, especially when you are behind them trying to build up speed to safely merge with the faster motorway and they are trundling down the slip road at 20 or 30 mph

Truck drivers fom monaghan & meath doing what??

They are legally entitled to be there, it’s not a motorway, doesn’t matter that it’s unsafe.

They probably don’t know which lane is which

Sometimes I stay in the right faster lane as otherwise you are constantly changing lanes passing slow traffic and constantly going over the cats eyes cant be good for the wheels. As long as you are willing to pull over for faster traffic. Youll always know that anyway as the lad will drive up your arse.

Audi owners do own the road though, didn’t you get the memo?

This comment has summed up the problem here for everyone!!!! No mention of overtaking while jimbo is sitting in the overtaking lane but jimbo is there doing the speed limit or more and thinks he’s in the right!!!!!!! Jimbo you are the problem for everyone

Good man Jimbo. You and your sort are the problem on the road.

How long are you driving france??

On an N or an R road I agree with you completely but on a clear motorway it is more dangerous to drive below the limit than slightly above it, the amount of drivers I’ve come up to on the M6, albeit in the correct lane usually, doing 40mph is is scary when everyone around them is doing around 70mph, is asking for trouble

Now I know you’re trolling…

Especially for you Sean, from the Rules of the Road:
“Overtake only on the right, unless traffic is travelling in slow moving queues and the traffic queue on your right is travelling more slowly than you are.”

Mattoid. You should get on to the RSA and tell them buses and taxis who drive 60kmh while undertaking other traffic moving slower are breaking the Rules of the Road. And stick to the bus!

They are in a separated bus lane that we aren’t allowed in and so are hardly likely to pull out in front of them unlike a car that’s in the last place you would expect it, your far side blind spot, in s lane you may wish to merge into and speeding up.

Joseph. On many occasions esp along North Strand inbound at 10am when it’s open to all traffic I have entered the out of use bus lane and have undertaken other traffic all the way into Amiens St with taxis and busses in front and behind yet if I am in the wrong as the majority of experts say then rules of the road need a serious review.

Sean is actually correct. It not illegal to undertake if the lane on your right is moving slower than you are or is obstructed. What rules are ye reading.

Michael, as has been quoted in more than one place on this thread, the rules of the road clearly state: “Overtake only on the right, unless traffic is travelling in slow moving queues and the traffic queue on your right is travelling more slowly than you are.”
ie. the only time you can legally overtake on an inside lane is when there is a SLOW MOVING QUEUE, such as a tailback from roadworks or an accident etc..
In any other situation it is illegal to use the inside lane for overtaking, and if anyone has told you otherwise they have misled you. If your driving instructor has told you otherwise you should be asking for your money back!
If some idiot is hogging the outside lane the only thing you can legally do is suck it up and wait for them to move, however frustrating it is.

Sean the north strand also isnt a motorway, motorways have their own separate set of rules and that is what we have all been referring to above.

@ Jane Ward

But Jane, all exits are on the left!

N4 onto m50 has exits both sides, is bloody terrifying until you get used to it!!

No on the m50 all the exits are on the left. On the dual carriageway they’re both sides.

I know it’s the n4 side that it’s both sides, when you leave the m50 north you come onto the n4 west on the right and you leave the n4 east on the right for the m50 south

Apologies Jane, I misunderstood :-)

Sorry I didn’t specify in the answer I meant Dual Carriageway only. On the Motorway I stick to the left, my car’s only small so the right lane isn’t really an option :) On the Dual Carriageway I generally stick to the left but if I know I’ll have to turn off from the right lane I move in a bit ahead of time. I was always told they were the same though I’m surprised at that but will modify my habits accordingly :)

“If I’m not in anyone else’s way, I don’t see the problem.”

Interesting. Are you ok with running red lights as long as nobody is using the intersection?

I can see where you’re coming from, but why would changing lanes be any less safe if there are no faster drivers behind you?